• Calculating slippage and commissions December 1 - 10:46 pm
• Free advise on E-mini S&P and E-mini Nasdaq day trading November 25 - 10:10 pm
• George Angell__"What a guy, what a trader, What a (fill in the blank )....." May 6 - 08:10 pm

Be warned you will get nothing from this guy. He runs identical cons under different names – watch out for the nnov.ru address that’s the give away.

He does not deliver but you will only find this out by sending the money because he is very convincing.

There are good honest pirates out there but this guy is not one of them – that is why he has to spam every thread – to cover up the complaints..

This is an excellent time for you to become a missing person. But paying retail rates is too much.

I am no longer needing all my old books for traders and some systems. I have burned trading software CD of software I buy. Trading Recipes, Trading Station, Rina. I sell all for USD 1450All information about collection will send on your e-mail

Do you send email with any questions.
E-mail: trader@infonet.nnov.ru

OneNightStand Recap:

For the markets below, out on this morning's open---

Dec EuroFX: ($1270)
Dec Swiss Franc: ($900)
Dec British Pound: ($110)


Have a good week!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!


Dec EuroFX @ 1.1829 Buy Stop
Dec Br. Pound @ 1.6893 Buy Stop
Dec Swiss Franc @ .7669 Buy Stop
Dec Japanese Yen @ .9250 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

Leonardo....

PS: One of these days, we're going to get some huge breakouts with this system.

OneNightStand Recap:

There were no trades last Friday in ONS.

Have a great week!

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:

For the markets below, out on this morning's open---

Dec Swiss Franc: ($1425)
Dec Japanese Yen: ($1500)
Dec EuroFX: ($2550)

Have a good week!

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:

There were no trades last Friday in ONS.

I was in the Northern woods of Minnesota on vacation so I didn't report.

This morning JYZ, SFZ and ECZ have all gone long. BPZ needs to hit 1.6682 stop to get long.

Have a great weekend!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!

Dec Gold @ 394.90 Buy Stop
Dec EuroFX @ 1.1747 Buy Stop
Dec Br. Pound @ 1.6672 Buy Stop
Dec Swiss Franc @ .7632 Buy Stop
Dec Japanese Yen @ .9106 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:


There were no trades this last weekend in ONS.

If you have been watching the yen, you are not alone. I admit to being long the yen for the last 3 weeks. I think it is the beginning of a very long move.

When everyone wants a pullback so they can get some or add to their position, usually the market won't fall off much right away. Any ONS trades should be fairly low risk on the yen for a while.

Leonardo

I absolutely trade ONS on Fridays when Monday is a holiday.

This does tend to make profits and losses greater in this situation because of the holiday, but since the system does trade in the direction of the trend the overwhelming odds favor continuance.

Leonardo....

Leonardo,

I'm sure you've probably got enough of thank you's by now, but really ... thanks for the interesting posts.

Have got a question: you said that you won't trade on Thursday of Friday is a holiday, but what if Monday is a holiday instead? Would you trade on Friday then? Thanks...

Leonardo,

Good job. Also, thanks for keeping this thread running. It's always interesting to monitor on an ongoing basis the actual performance of a mechanical strategy.

Richard

This weekend was a better than usual occurrence.

ONS has gone through many periods of slight profits and small losses and then big profits in spurts.

It may not be the best system ever made, but for time actually in the market, it is very hard to beat.

Leonardo....

Probably no deterioration after this day!

Leonardo,


You de Man!

You have my vote for contributing participant of the year !

Has there been a deterioration in ONS performance recently as alluded to by some in this forum ?

Nice!

OneNightStand Recap:

For the markets below, out on this morning's open---

Dec British Pound: $1150
Dec Japanese Yen: $2575
Dec EuroFX: $1525


Have a good week!

Leonardo....

The exact rule is exactly in the book which you can exactly buy from Borders or Amazon. It's so easy!

It was posted below on my birthday.

But what is the exact rule?

Yes, it is in his book.

Does anyone know what the exact rule is that Joe Krutsinger used in his book?

OneNightStand Recap:

For the market below, out on this morning's open---

Dec Silver: ($800)


May you all have a good week!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 9/12/03.

Dec Silver @ 5.375 Buy Stop
Dec Gold @ 368.90 Buy Stop
Dec Jap. Yen @ .8665 Buy Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:

For the market below, out on this morning's open---

Dec Gold: ($170)


Wish you all a great week!

Leonardo....

CORRECTION
One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 9/05/03.

Possible trades for today:

Dec Silver @ 5.20 Buy Stop
Dec Gold @ 379.10 Buy Stop

Either of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open. Getting out on Tuesdays isn't too bad statistically. In some currencies it's even more profitable. But it increases your exposure unnecessarily.

Leonardo....

PS: No offense meant, but I can't respond to questions from individuals without a working email address. This forum deserves validity.

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 9/05/03.

Possible trades for today:

Dec Silver @ 5.20 Buy Stop
Dec Gold @ 379.10 Buy Stop

Either of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Tuesday morning on the open.

Leonardo....

I have noticed that you post more losses then gains. Is this a string of losses that all systems must prepare for....or should you fade these signals?

Just curious, no disrespect

OneNightStand Recap:

For the markets below, out on Tuesday morning's open---

Dec Gold: ($50)
Sep Japanese Yen: ($537)

Wish you all a great week!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 8/29/03.

Dec Silver @ 5.19 Buy Stop *
Dec Gold @ 375.50 Buy Stop *
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8543 Buy Stop *
Sep Euro FX @ 1.0802 Sell Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.5602 Sell Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7014 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Tuesday morning on the open.

Leonardo....

* Large potential trade

OneNightStand Recap:

For the markets below, out on Monday morning's open---

Sep Euro FX: $50
Sep Br. Pound: ($38)
Sep Japanese Yen: $150
Sep Swiss Franc: ($125)

Wish you all a great week!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 8/22/03.

Sep Silver @ 5.08 Buy Stop
Dec Gold @ 368.90 Buy Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8516 Buy Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.0881 Sell Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.5724 Sell Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7060 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:

For the market below, out on this morning's open---

Sep British Pound: $400


Leonardo....

PS: Looks like this is going to be a great week in the grains!

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 8/15/03.

Sep Silver @ 5.17 Buy Stop
Dec Gold @ 368.90 Buy Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8307 Sell Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.1216 Sell Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.5946 Sell Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7276 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.
---------------------------------

Hope your weekend is good and that you aren't in New York City!

Trade on!

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:

There were no trades last Friday.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 8/08/03.

Sep Silver @ 5.235 Buy Stop
Dec Gold @ 369.80 Buy Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8295 Sell Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.1144 Sell Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.5978 Sell Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7269 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:

For the market below, out on this morning's open---

Sep Euro FX: ($1650)
Sep Japanese Yen: ($113)

Wish you all a great week!

Leonardo....

---TeeJ & Bill M---

Thanks for the good questions.

I trade ONS on just 6 markets; the four currencies, and gold and silver.

I do trade another mechanical, momentum-based system (Skyhook) on any of 25 - 30 markets, which include 6 European markets. Actually the only markets I've ever seen that it has a hard time making money on are the indexes. The system's trades last from about a day or two at most, and you get approximately one trade every 3-4 days per market. The average profit-per-trade is a little less than ONS on the currencies. Some markets are definitely more profitable than others due to their volatility. Example: Coffee. The profit-per-trade is approx. $300, with 73% wins over the last 29 years. Corn is less profitable; profit-per-trade is approx. $35, with 72% wins over the last 33 years.

So, off-floor, I would rather trade coffee. But, if I traded on the floor in Chicago, I would happily trade corn, and wheat and beans and meal and beanoil and trade 10's and 20's every signal. And still be the laziest floor trader there. Virtually no commissions, and definitely you would get the floor edge getting in and out.

The off-floor benefit is that you can trade all the hottest markets moving; you profit 60 - 70% of the time and you can compound your money faster since the one contract/trade equity curve is virtually a straight line, and the profitability has stayed the same or better than when I made the system 12 years ago. The negative is that even though you could theoretically place the orders in the market and walk away, you really should be handling the system yourself and watching the market if you trade more than 3 or 4 markets. Brokers are not going to be as interested as you to make sure that protective stops are in on positions that have been elected but not reported by the exchanges yet. Also, you can get better placement on trades by watching obvious spots for breakouts which would push the order flow into your signal area. This means trading gets fairly intense when you get up to fifteen markets. It takes 2 people to trade 30 markets and not miss trades.

ONS was designed by Joe Krutsinger to trade currencies. Although I have investigated it thoroughly (which anybody better do if they are thinking about trading something) and have added gold and silver to my mix, I don't see that it is worth trying to trade on any other markets.

I believe ONS works on currencies because of the predisposition of those who trade it. Even though futures traders can trade the market by futures contracts, the FX market is actually one of the biggest markets in the universe. Everything in every country is priced in a currency. If it is sold, mortgaged, insured by another country there can and often is an FX hedge placed on it. This FX community is different in nature to speculators, so there is a natural arb available to speculators if you find a way to monopolize on those differences. ONS is just one way to skin the cat.

It hasn't been very profitable for the last few years. Have you looked at the monthly and weekly charts? The currencies stayed in big ranges and had very few large trends for years. Where there is no risk to being unhedged, there are few arbing opportunities. No profit.

Now, the countries are trying to figure out if they should be in Euros or Pounds or Dollars, and there are profit opportunities again.

Thanks again for the interest.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 8/01/03.

Sep Silver @ 5.235 Buy Stop
Dec Gold @ 369.80 Buy Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8299 Sell Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.1209 Sell Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.5908 Sell Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7269 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

To Bill, Leonardo

Bill , your question was one I had been intending to ask myself, so I'm very interested in the answer. Also Bill, what interest rate instrument are you using? In my brief look it didn't seem to be profitable other than in some of the currencies.

Leonardo, I have made a few trades and am up a very modest amount, but I have the following worries:
- Why does the system seem to work only on a few currencies? If the system basis is on traders offloading weekend risk surely it should be more applicable, and be profitable on all those commodities which have a significant degree of speculator action? Surely these are not limited to the currencies?

- Also worrying is the fact that the system seems to be very much less profitable in recent years, why should this be? If this decline is continuing then, although it looks profitable (historically), we could currently be in a near breakeven or lossmaking period.

Leonardo, finally, thanks for your contributions to this forum, I'm always glad to see anything with your name on it

Hi Leonardo,

I've been having some success with ONS in interest rates.

You mentioned "25 markets" you and a friend were talking about trading together...

I can't find nearly that many commodities that ONS looks happy on.

Are you folks looking at a lot of non-US markets?

If anyone else reading this thread has found other good markets, care to share?

Bill M

OneNightStand Recap:

There were no trades Friday.

Silver is on a tear. Wouldn't be surprised to see it go a good deal further. Perhaps the Buffet highs. Gold isn't doing too bad either.

Have a great week.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 7/25/03.

Two potential trades today--

Sep Silver @ 5.17 Buy Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8389 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

---Bill M.---

Pretty slick. Thanks for sharing your code.

Leonardo....

QUICK ONE NIGHT STAND filters for TS users:

It was 11pm Thursday evening when I realized I'd forgotten about the week's ONS entries. Twenty minutes later I had them all emailed to my broker. Below are the TS tools I use to semi-automate the process.

Create a folder with a workspace for each of the markets you follow. Each workspace runs the same two analysis techniques and one system.

The system is the last shown lower down this thread.

The two analysis techniques are a colored MA cross and an indicator called a "ONS Trigger" which gives entry levels.

If the MA's are both painting dark red, we look at the sell number in the trigger; both dark green, we look to enter on the buy side.

Remember to remove brackets around the "greater than" or "less than" signs when verifying:

______________________

ONS COLORED MOVING AVERAGE

inputs: Price( Close), FastLength( 10), SlowLength( 40),
UPcolor(darkgreen),
DNcolor(darkred);

Plot1( AverageFC( Price, FastLength ), "10" ) ;
Plot2( AverageFC( Price, SlowLength ), "40" ) ;


if Plot1 (>) Plot2 then
SetPlotColor( 1, UpColor )
else if Plot1 () Plot2 then
SetPlotColor(2, UpColor )
else if Plot1 (<) Plot2 then
SetPlotColor(2, DnColor ) ;


if Plot1 crosses over Plot2 then
Alert( "Bullish alert" )
else if Plot1 crosses under Plot2 then
Alert( "Bearish alert" ) ;

____________________________________

ONS TRIGGER Indicator


input: offset(.0001);

Value1 = Highest(high, 10)+offset ;
Plot1( Value1, "Go Long at" ) ;

Value2 = LowestFC(low, 8)-offset ;
Plot2( Value2, "Go Short at" ) ;

_____________________________________

The Trigger is clearest when plotted as dots.

If value1 is plotted in green and value2 red, the long and short entry numbers will appear in the right hand value scale on the chart in those colors. Match the MA color to that value and there's the buy or sell stop for tomorrow.

Set the "offset" value to one tick for the market shown your chart.

Feel free to email questions.

Bill M

--CB---

Anywhere from $2000 to $3000 for options which expire in 46 days.

Leonardo....

PS: there are many resources on the web which give you option prices. Use Google to find them.

OneNightStand Recap:

For the market below, out on this morning's open---

Sep British Pound: ($512)

Wish you all a great week!

Leonardo....

Leonardo,

Can you tell me about what the U.S. Dollar value is of an option that's right at the money (or the closest to the money) on the Swiss Franc, or Japanese Yen, or the Pound. I just want to know arround what these options cost when they're right at the money with about 2-3 months to expiration.

Thanks in advance

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 7/18/03.

Sep Silver @ 4.90 Buy Stop
Aug Gold @ 340.70 Sell Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8591 Buy Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.1118 Sell Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.5785 Sell Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7215 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:

For the market below, out on this morning's open---

Aug Gold: ($390)

Wish you all a great week!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 7/11/03.

Sep Silver @ 4.90 Buy Stop
Aug Gold @ 342.30 Sell Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8334 Sell Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.1236 Sell Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.6668 Buy Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7274 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

To Trey:
I tested ONS with 20 liquid markets with fixed fractional money management,up till end of 2001.
Me too I noticed a decrease in performance in last years,on three or four little variants of the system.

By the way,I don't understand why system traders should need someone to post the trades when they have the system disclosed.Do they find it tiring to run the system on their current daily data?
I thank Leonardo for his work(and first of all for giving us the system),but I don't understand some comments in which someone feels lost if Leonardo doesn't post anymore.
Anyone should test by himself,run the system on real-time data,judge it and think about it,without the need of someone else posting the trades and repeatedly explaining this system benefits.

CORRECT CODE FOR TS 7 --- last post did not use two ma's.
Take out the ( ) around the ( > )


INPUT: Multi(0);
INPUT: daysin(0);
VAR: Cons(0), AboveMA(TRUE);

IF Multi=0 THEN Cons=1 ELSE Cons = 5000 / ( StdDev( Close - Close[1], 30) * BigPointValue) ;

IF (Average(Close,40) ( > ) Average(Close, 40)) THEN AboveMA=TRUE else AboveMA=FALSE;

IF DayofWeek(Date)=4 AND AboveMA=TRUE THEN
Buy Cons Contracts Next Bar at Highest(High, 10) Stop;

IF DayofWeek(Date)=4 AND AboveMA=FALSE THEN
Sell short Cons Contracts Next Bar at Lowest(Low, 8) Stop;

If MarketPosition = +1 and BarsSinceEntry = daysin then sell Next Bar at market;

If MarketPosition = -1 and BarsSinceEntry = daysin then sell short Next Bar at market;

Also off topic and probably a really stupid question, I have TS4 and 7 but just tried ONS in TS2000 for the first time. The code below verified fine in Power Editor as a signal but when I go to insert strategy it’s not there. What am I doing wrong?

-Chris C.

You are guaranteed to get in on the close, but you may definitely get a different fill from the official close which is determined after the close based on the trades in the closing range.

Leonardo....

Off the subject, but this thread is fairly active and seems to have some nice people frequenting it.

Question: If I place a MarketOnClose order, is it guaranteed to get filled at the close, and also at the closing price(tradind E-mini SP) or is ther slippage?

Although the historical performance of ONS is impressive, it appears that the system is losing it's edge. On the six markets suggested by Leonardo, ONS has lost money since the beginning of 2000 to date, around 3,000 dollars. I tested ONS in Tradestation using Pinnacle back-adjusted data and included 50 dollars for transaction costs on a one lot basis. Only one market was profitable over this period, the euro-currency. Has anyone else noticed this?

By JaneW


---"Would the 5,000 come from Leonardo's maximum amount to trade in a single position?"---

Yes, you have to have a limit for testing purposes because otherwise you would get grossly overrated results. I think 5000 is almost too high, but keep it that way because a trader could get size like that filled in Forex.

I believe that One Night Stand is going to remain especially profitable for quite a few years, especially since the Dollar, after so many years of supremacy, is now seriously challenged. Extra uncertainty tends to benefit shorter term systems.

Leonardo....

Here's the code for TS 7:

INPUT: Multi(0);
INPUT: daysin(0);
VAR: Cons(0), AboveMA(TRUE);

IF Multi=0 THEN Cons=1 ELSE Cons = 5000 / ( StdDev( Close - Close[1], 30) * BigPointValue) ;

IF (Close > Average(Close, 40)) THEN AboveMA=TRUE else AboveMA=FALSE;

IF DayofWeek(Date)=4 AND AboveMA=TRUE THEN
Buy Cons Contracts Next Bar at Highest(High, 10) Stop;

IF DayofWeek(Date)=4 AND AboveMA=FALSE THEN
Sell short Cons Contracts Next Bar at Lowest(Low, 8) Stop;

If MarketPosition = +1 and BarsSinceEntry = daysin then sell Next Bar at market;

If MarketPosition = -1 and BarsSinceEntry = daysin then sell short Next Bar at market;

Thank you for the infomation on posting fixed width.

I'm still at a loss to what the logic is of using 68.2% of the variation between today's close and yesterday's to influence the size of a position.

Would the 5,000 come from Leonardo's maximum amount to trade in a single position?

Thank you again,

Chuck LeBeau--

Thanks for the note. Didn't realize that the forum had such cool features.

I wish all my trades were winners.

Leonardo....

Leonardo,

This BB allows for automatic forwarding of messages and that's how I receive my copies of everything and I think there are other members that also have the messages forwarded. Unfortunately the red coloring gets lost when the message is forwarded.

You might want to put parens around the losses as well as the red coloring ($240)so the forwarded messages can clearly show losses.

Heck, I thought every trade you posted was a winner!

Thanks again for your many contributions to our Forum.

To: Anonymous on Tuesday, July 1, 2003 - 08:02 am:

The number 240 was in red. This means minus vs. black for positive numbers.

I sorry if everyone didn't know that.

Leonardo....

PS: Thanks to Anonymous on Tuesday, July 1, 2003 - 09:11 am: for the bold post.

This bbs system goes nuts when it sees the characters for greater-than ( > ) and less-than ( < ). It also gets confused when it sees the curly braces { and } . The first solution is to become expert with "escapes" and use them as I just did above. The second solution is to post code in fixed width bold font. Like so:

INPUT: Multi(0);
INPUT: daysin(0);
VAR: Cons(0), AboveMA(TRUE);

IF Multi=0 THEN Cons=1 ELSE Cons = 5000 / ( StdDev( Close - Close[1], 30) * BigPointValue) ;

IF (Close > Average(Close, 40)) THEN AboveMA=TRUE else AboveMA=FALSE;

IF DayofWeek(Date)=4 AND AboveMA=TRUE THEN
Buy Cons Contracts Next Bar at Highest(High, 10) Stop;

IF DayofWeek(Date)=4 AND AboveMA=FALSE THEN
Sell Cons Contracts Next Bar at Lowest(Low, 8) Stop;

If MarketPosition = +1 and BarsSinceEntry = daysin then ExitLong Next Bar at market;

If MarketPosition = -1 and BarsSinceEntry = daysin then ExitShort Next Bar at market;


The input Multi tells the system whether to trade single contracts (when Multi=0) or multiple contracts (when Multi=1). The variable Cons holds the calculated number of contracts.

Would someone be willing to tell a new-to-TradeStation person what the second paragraph ( If Multi )is doing in this code from Leonardo? Also what the last line (IF cons) is doing?

Thank you

INPUT: Multi(0);
INPUT: daysin(0);
VAR: Cons(0), AboveMA(TRUE);

IF Multi=1 THEN
Cons = 5000 / ( StdDev( Close - Close[1], 30) * BigPointValue)
ELSE
Cons = 1;

IF Cons Average(Close, 40);

Leonardo,

(I didn't take this trade, just want to clarify.)


For Friday June 27, there was a sell stop in Aug Gold at 343.40.

I show a Friday low of 343.30 and so short.

Monday open was 345.70...

Isn't a loss of $ 240 rather than a gain as shown?


Thanks

Leonardo,

I am a fool. My code had a simple mistake that I should have picked up on had I slowed down and checked what the logic in my code was saying. The back test results are excellent.

damian

-damian-

>>If there is no trading on a Friday, you have NO trade<<

Those are the rules that Joe Krutsinger made a part of One Night Stand. If you wish to trade it differently, that is your choice.

I've tested trading over 3 day weekends, and it works well enough. The thing is, now the conditions are different; it is definitely a holiday, and people trade differently just before a holiday than just a weekend. Many people go on vacations around holidays.

Again, you can choose to do what you wish. Apparently Joe K. just wanted something simple with the least amount of variance.

Leonardo

Hi Leonardo,

you said:

>>If there is no trading on a Friday, you have NO trade<<

Why is that? wouldn't the same concept still apply, in fact more so as now traders will be even less willing to hold a position over a 3 day run of shut markets? I have tried to code the alternative entry day - Thursday - if there is no Friday of trading but have been not so skillful in manipulating teh various date functions in my software.

BTW, I have not had very good results in backtesting ONS at all, which stumps me as others I have spoken to see good back test results. Not to matter, I will work it out.

OneNightStand Recap:

For the markets below, out on this morning's open---

Aug Gold: $240
Sep Jap. Yen: $225
Sep Swiss Franc: $312

It wasn't too tough to do a lot better than the above figures because of Friday's action. The official entries (sells) on all of the above were at the low of the day. And still the system worked. Pretty impressive.

Have a good week.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 6/27/03. (Date Correction)

Aug Gold @ 343.40 Sell Stop
Jul Silver @ 4.4850 Sell Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8391 Sell Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.1846 Buy Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.6802 Buy Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7411 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 6/13/03.

Aug Gold @ 343.40 Sell Stop
Jul Silver @ 4.4850 Sell Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8391 Sell Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.1846 Buy Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.6802 Buy Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7411 Sell Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

Hello Leonardo/All-
Would anyone be so kind as to post the code for Tradestation 7.x? I could not get Leonardo's code to verify. Thanks in advance!

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 6/20/03.

No trades today.
Have a good weekend.

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap:

Again, no trades. No profits..., no losses.


Leonardo----

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 6/13/03.

Aug Gold @ 370.60 Buy Stop
Jul Silver @ 4.4250 Sell Stop
Sep Jap. Yen @ .8386 Sell Stop
Sep Euro FX @ 1.1856 Buy Stop
Sep Br. Pound @ 1.6624 Buy Stop
Sep Swiss Franc @ .7765 Buy Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

Leonardo,

Thanks for your reply - your take on simultaneously trading a volatility system with ONS will certainly be a focus of research for me.......unfortunately im still hopeless with Trading Recipes, need to put a few more hours in.

The Kid.

OneNightStand Recap:

No trades. No profits..., no losses.


Leonardo----

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 6/6/03.

Aug Gold @ 374.80 Buy Stop
Jul Silver @ 4.4750 Sell Stop
Jun Jap. Yen @ .8614 Buy Stop
Jun Euro FX @ 1.1927 Buy Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.6614 Buy Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7829 Buy Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

Cincinatti Kid:

Very good question.

After a person gets used to trading OneNightStand and figures out that it'll work for him, he needs to be able to put on more size to make it worth his while. Unless he just wants a little annuity account which trades one contract. If you have the time and desire to go professional (trade in realtime) ONS is very tradable on Forex when you end up handling size.

I use a volatility-breakout protective stop to guage my risk and use as a stop-and-reverse. Many times the stop-and-reverse ends up being profitable enough to erase the loss from a failed OneNightStand trade. The concept is well researched by many people with very readable tomes by Larry Williams (volatility-breakout KING) and Linda Bradford Raschke.

If a trader wants, he can trade a volatility breakout system simultaneously with OneNightStand. Volatility systems aren't perfect by any means, but they do work. Trading Recipes will do great correlation studies for you.



Leonardo----

Leonardo,

Much appreciate your efforts re ONS. I would be interested to hear your thoughts on risk and money mangement applied to a system like this where the dollar value of your stop loss is not known in advance. How many contracts do you buy if you dont know what your loss will be? Do you just use the average loss as a guide?

The Kid.

Chuck LeBeau--
Thanks for the nice comments.

I know that Mr. Krutsinger has mixed reviews with some traders, but he has found a few very interesting tendencies with his work with other traders and the markets. And one of the slickest, though not overly appreciated (or overtraded) is OneNightStand.

It works too well for me to quit trading it. And I agree with Joe Krutsinger that almost nobody will ever seriously trade it. Hence the reason the numbers are so consistent. And the profits per contract aren't big enough for a fund to risk trying to exploit it.

If anyone has found a trading method which has a similar profile I would appreciate them posting it or contacting me and I'll monitor it for everybody if they wish. At the very least, please contact me about it.

-------------------------
Tama--
OneNightStand was designed for just these original 4 currencies:
German Mark
British Pound
Swiss Franc
Japanese Yen
_______________________________________
Over ten years ago I tested the precious metals and found that the same principle worked for them-- in fact much better than the currencies when they are in play. So I've traded them every since.

In recent years the Mark was replaced by the EuroFx and it has continued to work just fine.

Good ideas are hard to kill.

Leonardo-----

Was the original One Night Stand system recommended for precious metals trading? Or just the currencies?

Leonardo,

I just wanted to thank you for your efforts in posting this info for us every week. I'm sure I'm not the only one that appreciates it.

I have to admit that I was sceptical at first but I have been amazed at how profitable this strategy has been.

Thanks again.

OneNightStand Recap:

No trades. No profits..., no losses.


Leonardo----

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 5/30/03.

Dec Gold @ 376.10 Buy Stop
Jun Jap. Yen @ .8644 Buy Stop
Jun Euro FX @ 1.1927 Buy Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.6536 Buy Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7829 Buy Stop

Any of the trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on the open.

Best wishes!

Leonardo....

Thanks, Andrew:

It is a slower trading day. Not much to do when markets are going your way, except be to watchful that something which matters doesn't change.

Since December of 2002, when OneNightStand was discussed in this thread, there have been 27 currency signals and 12 precious metal signals. A short recap follows, without commission or slippage included:

SF---- 9 trades/4 profitable---$100/trade
BP---- 4 trades/3 profitable---$290/trade
JY---- 4 trades/2 profitable---$472/trade
FX---- 10 trades/8 profitable---$458/trade
Currencies: 71% profitable---$176/trade
___________________________________
GC---- 7 trades/4 profitable---$57/trade
SV---- 5 trades/3 profitable---$50/trade
Precious Metals: 58% profitable---$54/trade
___________________________________

I know a lot of successful pit guys trading with a much smaller edge than OneNightStand.

Have a great trading day.

Leonardo----

Leonardo,

Thankyou very much. I appreciate the time you take to post the trades, as well as to answer questions.

Andrew

OneNightStand is pretty simple.

The following is how my code trades OneNightStand in the currencies; EuroFX, British Pound, Japanese Yen, and Swiss Franc. I also trade Gold and Silver (the original currencies) with excellent results.

If the ten period moving average is higher than the 40 period moving average, you have a buy setup.
If the ten period moving average is lower than the 40 period moving average, you have a sell setup.

If you have a buy setup, on Fridays buy the market on a stop 1 tick (12.50) above the highest high of the last ten days.

If you have a sell setup, on Fridays sell the market on a stop 1 tick (12.50) below the lowest low of the last eight days.

(This difference of 10 days for a buy vs. 8 days for a sell is not my idea, but that of the author. His reasoning was something having to do with the market being quicker to correct itself on the downside--hence the 8 day requirement. I have tried various different breakout requirements, both higher and lower with very little difference. I leave it at 10/8 because "if it isn't broken, don't fix it.")

Now for the last item, getting out. If you got stopped into the market(s) on Friday, get out on Monday morning's open. If there is no Monday trade, then get out on Tuesday's open.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

NOTE: If there is no trading on a Friday, you have NO trade. Also, there are no hard money stops. If you include them you will have to change the code. I've done it before, and the performance deteriorates a bit. Remember, the exposure of this trade is very brief, and tends to be profitable because of the built up momentum in the market and the unwillingness for people (even big funds) to hold over weekends.

Long term trading works primarily because of the same principle, receiving a premium for holding contracts overnight----every night. There is a risk premium donated to long term traders for holding contracts for which others are willing to pay incrementally more to have access to them.

Hope this is useful.

Leonardo....

Yes I did see the post. There's another post I saw as well. Apparently you missed this one.

"By Leonardo on Tuesday, December 10, 2002 - 12:28 pm:
One Night Stand---

If anyone wants my personal code for OneNightStand for Tradestation 2000i--- send me an email; and I will send it to you. It has slightly fewer trades, higher profit factor and profit/trade."

Clearly Leonardo indicates his system is not quite the same as the rules explained on Monday, December 9, 2002.
He then goes on to post the code for TS-2000i, but I don't think it posted correctly and if it did I'm having trouble converting it to TS7.

I hope that's a good enough explaination for you anonymous!

Have a look at Monday December 9 2002.

Couldn't you have scrolled down yourself and seen this?

Leonardo,

Will you post the One Night Stand rules in English please (The way you trade the system). I want to code them myself into TS7.

Thankyou in advance, Andrew

One Night Stand Recap:

For the market below, out on this morning's open---

Jun Euro FX: $1375

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 5/23/03.

Jun Gold @ 373.30 Buy Stop
Jun Jap. Yen @ .8666 Buy Stop
Jun Euro FX @ 1.1733 Buy Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.6466 Buy Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7796 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Tuesday morning on open.

Have a great holiday weekend!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Recap: (Correction)

For the markets below, out on this morning's open---

Jun Gold: $190
Jun British Pound: $375

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Recap:

For the markets below, out on this morning's open---

Jun Gold: $230
Jun Euro FX: $375

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 5/16/03.

Jun Gold @ 355.70 Buy Stop
July Silver @ 4.915 Buy Stop
Jun Jap. Yen @ .8666 Buy Stop
Jun Euro FX @ 1.1594 Buy Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.6252 Buy Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7683 Buy Stop


All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Recap:

For the market below, out on Monday's (5/12/03) open---

Jun EuroFX: $1075

Didn't update sooner-- travelling.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 5/9/03.

Jun Gold @ 350.10 Buy Stop
July Silver @ 4.84 Buy Stop
Jun Jap. Yen @ .8633 Buy Stop
Jun Euro FX @ 1.1489 Buy Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.6148 Buy Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7649 Buy Stop


All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

The metals are hot! Great potential.

Wish everyone a good weekend. Nothing but rain where I live.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Recap:

For the markets below, out on this morning's open---

Jun Gold: $190
Jul Silver: $150

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 5/2/03.

Jun Gold @ 343.90 Buy Stop
July Silver @ 478.10 Buy Stop
Jun Euro FX @ 1.1271 Buy Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.6096 Buy Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7485 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

A lot of action in these markets lately, so these trades have some decent potential.

Wish everyone a great weekend.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Recap:

For the markets below, out on this morning's open---

Jun Japanese Yen: $729
Jun Euro: $150

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 4/25/03.


Jun Euro FX @ 1.1030 Buy Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.5932 Buy Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7182 Sell Stop
Jun Japanese Yen @ .8297 Sell Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

Have a great weekend!!!

Leonardo....

To John Bingnamie PhD, DsC---

I'm happy to help. I know how hard it is for most people to trade anything that works, even if it is a minor system/method.

I appreciate the thanks.

Leonardo....

Leonardo,

A heartfelt thank you for your hardwork and diligence

One Night Stand Alert!
None-- no trading on Friday, April 18, 2003.

I wish everyone a great weekend.

Leonardo

One Night Stand Recap

For trade below, out on this morning's open---

Jun Japanese Yen: $12

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 4/11/03.

The only likely trade today was:

Jun Japanese Yen @ .8298 Sell Stop

The trade above, if entered--is to be exited Monday morning on open.

Have a great weekend!

Leonardo

One Night Stand Recap

In all cases, out on this morning's open---

Jun Gold: $330
Jun British Pound: $712
Jun Swiss Franc: $1275

In this case the trades were much more profitable than they appeared they would be after Friday's action.

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 4/4/03.

Jun Gold @323.90 Sell Stop
May Silver @ 4.3450 Sell Stop
Jun Euro FX @ 1.0599 Sell Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.5542 Sell Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7227 Sell Stop
Jun Japanese Yen @ .8334 Sell Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 3/28/03.

No trades today.

Have a wonderful weekend!

leonardo....

One Night Stand Recap

In all cases, out on this morning's open---

Apr Gold: $130
May Silver: $75
Jun Swiss Franc: $600

The trades were not as profitable as they appeared they would be after Friday's action.

As stated in this forum many times before, trading is definitely a numbers game.

Leonardo

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 3/21/03.

Apr Gold @331.90 Sell Stop
May Silver @ 4.3950 Sell Stop
Jun Br. Pound @ 1.5478 Sell Stop
Jun Swiss Franc @ .7188 Sell Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 3/14/03.

No trades are going to happen today!

I wish everyone a great weekend.

Leonardo----

OneNightStand Recap

In all cases, out on this morning's open---

Mar EuroFX: $50
Mar Japanese Yen: $237
Mar Swiss Franc: $50

Didn't lose as much as it appeared it would after Friday's action.

Leonardo

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 3/7/03

Mar EuroFX @1.1008 Buy Stop
Mar Swiss Franc @ .7541 Buy Stop
Mar Japanese Yen @ .8563 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

Have a great weekend!

Leonardo....

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 2/28/03

Mar EuroFX @1.0848 Buy Stop
Mar Swiss Franc @ 74.16 Buy Stop
Mar Japanese Yen @ .8563 Buy Stop
Mar Br. Pound @ 1.5678 Sell Stop
Apr Comex Gold @ 342.90 Sell Stop
May Comex Silver @ 451.10 Sell Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

Have a great weekend!

Leonardo....

Leonardo,

Thanks and here is a web site that estimates equity curves based on win loos ratio and & wins...enjoy

www.hquotes.com/tradehard/simulator.html

Yes, Shariz Hamadenian, I do take the trades-- most of the time.

If I am already extremely long or short from another method the day before the signal happens I usually just waive the entry and drop some of my load on the Monday morning's open.

The system has a very large edge, but just like J. Krutsinger has noted, very few will ever adopt the system.

That's fine. In my experience, the best systems are a bit abnoxious.

Leonardo....

Leonardo,

Are you trading this system or just helping by posting the trades.

We appreciate any insights you have in either case ....have a good one

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 2/7/03

Mar EuroFX @108.89 Buy Stop
Mar Br. Pound @ 1.6484 Buy Stop
Mar Swiss Franc @ 74.49 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

Have a great weekend!

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Alert!

No trades elected today.

See you next week.

Leonardo

One Night Stand Alert!
--for Friday, 1/31/03

Apr Gold @374.10 Buy Stop
Mar EuroFX @108.59 Buy Stop
Mar Silver @ 495.50 Buy Stop
Mar Br. Pound @ 1.6484 Buy Stop
Mar Swiss Franc @ 74.20 Buy Stop
Mar Japanese Yen @ .8537 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

Have a great weekend!

Leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap

In all cases, out on Monday's open---

Apr Gold: $340
Mar EuroFX: $1062
Mar Br. Pound: $237
Mar Swiss Franc: $450

This week was fairly profitable!

Have a great day!

Leonardo

One Night Stand Alert!

Apr Gold @368.60 Buy Stop
Mar EuroFX @107.56 Buy Stop
Mar Br. Pound @ 1.6188 Buy Stop
Mar Swiss Franc @ 73.78 Buy Stop
Mar Japanese Yen @ .8537 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

leonardo....

OneNightStand Recap

In all cases, out on the open---

Mar EuroFX: $37
Mar Br. Pound: $700
Mar Swiss Franc: $87
Mar Japanese Yen: $1187

Have a great day!

Leonardo

Leonardo:

What were the results from this week's One Night Stand system?

Correction
All trades below, if entered--are to be exited Tuesday morning on open.

One Night Stand Alert!

Feb Gold @359.10 Buy Stop
Mar EuroFX @106.04 Buy Stop
Mar Br. Pound @ 1.6085 Buy Stop
Mar Swiss Franc @ 72.97 Buy Stop
Mar Japanese Yen @ .8529 Buy Stop

All trades above, if entered--are to be exited Monday morning on open.

Have a great weekend!

Email me for the code, TeeJ.

I'll be happy to send it to you.

Leonardo

Leonardo
Many thanks for your explanation of fading, I'm afraid I have one other request:

- The code as posted does not verify (I'm using 2000i), its looking for BAR or BARS at the end of the 'IF Cons Average(Close,40):' . I don't quite understand this, any ideas? I'm still not too confident on Easylangusge so I coud be making a very basic error.

Regards

In all cases, out on the open---

Feb Gold: $430-
Mar EuroFX: $587+
Mar Swiss Franc: $125+

(From the quotes @ MRCI.com)

Not spectacular, but this is a numbers game.

Leonardo....

Leonardo:

How did the One-Night Stand recommendation for 1/10 work out? Let us know. Thanks.

Fading means going opposite the system, selling at the numbers when the system says buy, or buying when the system says sell.

The trades known as Turtle Soup and Turtle Soup Plus One popularized by Street Smarts by Laurence Connors and Linda B. Raschke are systems which "fade" the vaunted Turtle Method, which is a pretty straightforward breakout system.

Corn just had a Turtle Soup Plus One trade (a sell last Thursday) which was obviously perfect for the tremendous sell-off on Friday. Of course, I didn't take it. But I'm sure someone did.

Leonardo....

Leonardo,

On Dec 11th you said 'I would not recommend fading this system. That would be painful. ' What is meant by fading a system?

Thanks in advance for this, also for your postings here,

Regards

One Night Stand alert!

Feb Gold @356.10 Buy Stop
Mar EuroFX @105.05 Buy Stop
Mar Swiss Franc @ 72.51 Buy Stop

Have a great weekend!

Joe is pure Evil. If he just ripped people off for the price of the systems that would be fine, but people loose 10 and 20 times that amount trading them.

In the last 2 years that I have been on Joe K's mailing list he has come out with at least 20 systems. They all work better than the one before..lol. I assume he has 100's of systems, I would guess if they all worked other than during the optimized portion of the results he wouldn't need to create so many so fast. When I talked to him he suggested reoptimzing every couple of weeks. He maybe a nice guy, but most real good "salesman" are going to say all the right things.

Joe K makes his living sell to us. After months of testing his systems and talking with him and with his sales person, I've come to the following conclusions.

1- Joe's living is more important to him than my equity.

2- He's willing to "bend" system results to sell me systems that have little expectation of winning in the future.

3- Like other vendors, Joe uses FuturesTruth results to HIDE system weaknesses.

4- That he does all this with a straight face and sincere presentation.

5- If I were a new trader I'd have paid big bucks for systems that JoeK knew almost certainly work.

========================================================

Joe was excited to show me the two-year FT reports on one of his equity systems. It had *phenominal* results.

But all that was provided were total recaps of each stock, no trade-by-trade for the period.

I had a friend who owned the system.

I asked him to send me the trade-by-trade over the same two years.

NOT ONE of the stocks traded had been profitable in the second year of the test. They had all made enormous profits during the runup to bubble blow-off in NDX, but had been miserable failures since then.

If Joe had posted only the second year results, no one would have bought the thing.

Remember, he was *excited* to be telling me about this wonderful system.

=====================================================

That's one example with one system. I've got a handfull of similar.

If you're thinking about buying a system, talk to brokers who trade the system for their clients. If you ask the right questions, ask to see actual trade data, it's a way to filter some of the BS.

correction for previous post--

Gold (from 8/18/75 to present) had an average trade of $214.06 and a profit factor of 3.04.

Leonardo--

One Night Stand

I meant to insert a post that the precious metals (gold and silver) have put in a good showing using OneNightStand.

With the metals heating up, it might pay to trade them over the weekends using this system. OneNightStand averages about 10 trades a year, each, on both silver and gold.

The following report is from Comex Silver on backward adjusted data from 1/02/73 to today.

Gold has a higher profit per trade ($300+) and profit factor (3.00+) over the same period. (Not shown) What I find especially interesting---- even with the low volatility and prices of the past few years, this system has held its own-- breakeven and better when virtually nothing (mechanical) has worked on the metals. With the increased volatility going into the metals, and if more interest returns towards the concept of inflation and metal hoarding, trading the metals might very well exceed the profit of trading straight currencies.


TradeStation System Report -
OneNightStand SI.LNG-Daily

Performance Summary: All Trades


Total Net Profit-------------$93,800.00

Gross Profit-----------------$158,030.00
Gross Loss-------------------($64,230.00)

Total # of trades---------------296
Percent profitable--------------56.00%
Number winning trades-----------167
Number losing trades------------129

Largest winning trade-----------$6,500.00
Largest losing trade-----------($6,600.00)
Average winning trade-----------$946.29
Average losing trade-----------($497.91)
Ratio avg win/avg loss----------1.90
Avg trade (win & loss)----------$316.89

Max consec. Winners-------------16
Max consec. losers--------------6
Avg # bars in winners-----------1
Avg # bars in losers------------1

Max intraday drawdown----------($12,850.00)
Profit Factor-------------------2.46
Max # contracts held------------1
Account size required-----------$12,850.00
Return on account---------------729.96%


Have a good holiday!

Leonardo---

One Night Stand--

On Friday, December 27th; in the ECH and SFH the system went long the ECH @ 103.43 and long the SFH @ .7152 right after the open on stops. Sold out Monday morning on the open--ECH @ 103.85 ($525+), SFH @ .7173 ($262+).

Too bad the JYH missed triggering us in by just a few ticks on Friday. Nice gap away Monday.

Best wishes to everyone for the next year.

-Leonardo-

If you email him he will let you evaluate on a trial basis his systems and you can test them yourself over as many years as you care to.

Do not trust anything by JK. His best system is the one posted free below.

han anybody had any experience with the following systems sold by Krutisinger - Ranger, Traders Dream or Queen. I was looking at them on his website - the link is given below - and they look half decent but the backtest reports for some of them cover just 12 months. That worries me I would hade to pay $3,000 for a system that had awfull results for the previous 5 years and good results for just the last 12 months ?. If you have purchased one of these systems I would be most grateful to hear your opinion on it. Thanks

One Night Stand--

In the ECH, BPH and SFH the system went long the BPH @ 1.5764, long the ECH @ 101.86, long the SFH @6940 right on the open this morning on stops.

Now you just exit your longs on Monday's open.

(And may the lord have mercy on your souls.)

I would be happy to put the code out here. I hope it transfers the way it should.

--One Night Stand--
---------------------------------------


INPUT: Multi(0);
INPUT: daysin(0);
VAR: Cons(0), AboveMA(TRUE);

IF Multi=1 THEN
Cons = 5000 / ( StdDev( Close - Close[1], 30) * BigPointValue)
ELSE
Cons = 1;

IF Cons Average(Close, 40);

IF DayofWeek(Date)=4 AND AboveMA=TRUE
THEN
Buy ("One Buy") Cons Contracts Next Bar at Highest(High, 10) Stop;

IF DayofWeek(Date)=4 AND AboveMA=FALSE
THEN
Sell ("One Sell") Cons Contracts Next Bar at Lowest(Low, 8) Stop;


If MarketPosition = +1 and BarsSinceEntry = daysin then ExitLong ("One Exit-Ln") Next Bar at market;

If MarketPosition = -1 and BarsSinceEntry = daysin then ExitShort ("One Exit-Sh") Next Bar at market;


------------------------------------------------

I would not recommend fading this system. That would be painful.

Even though it can have a fair string of losers, it is very likely to get many more winners and the losers usually aren't that big.

The best thing about the system that almost noone picks up on is the margin efficiency. The concept, usually demonstrated by comparing different systems' profit-per-day per-commodity; was mainly touted by Bob Buran (a low key promoter of volatility breakout systems), basically deals with the time value of money and time value of risk.

If you aren't in the market that much, the market has a much harder time ripping you up--- so if you are in a trade only when you have higher probabilities of continuance, you can keep investing your capital in different markets (but similar type trades) until you are making maybe 3-5 times as much money as a system like Aberration with smaller drawdowns. Without daytrading.

That's the concept. It's possible, but entails quite a bit of coordination trading multiple markets. It gets tough after 15. A good trading friend of mine wants to tag team it with me and trade 25 together....

Maybe next year.

Have a great day, everybody!!!!

Leonardo-------

Leonardo,

I tried to email you for your version but mail was returned undeliverable, could you just post it here?

One Night Stand---

If anyone wants my personal code for OneNightStand for Tradestation 2000i--- send me an email; and I will send it to you. It has slightly fewer trades, higher profit factor and profit/trade.

You can also input how many additional days you want to hold before you exit, to test the persistence of the entry.

Best wishes!!!!

Leonardo--------

Many thanks you all - much appreciated - actually it does not look like to bad a system and at least itis different to the standard trend following currency systems like Aberration and Dollar Trader. I will check the correlations ?

No slippage deducted:

TradeStation Strategy Performance Report


TradeStation Strategy Performance Report - One Night Stand @JY-Daily (6/2/1981-12/9/2002) (6/2/1981-12/9/2002)

Performance Summary: All Trades

Total Net Profit $70,650.0000 Open position P/L $0.0000
Gross Profit $134,925.0000 Gross Loss ($64,275.0000)

Total # of trades 376 Percent profitable 62.23%
Number winning trades 234 Number losing trades 142

Largest winning trade $3,925.0000 Largest losing trade ($2,237.5000)
Average winning trade $576.6026 Average losing trade ($452.6408)
Ratio avg win/avg loss 1.2739 Avg trade (win & loss) $187.8989

Max consec. Winners 11 Max consec. losers 7
Avg # bars in winners 1 Avg # bars in losers 1

Max intraday drawdown ($6,300.0000)
Profit Factor 2.0992 Max # contracts held 1
Account size required $6,300.0000 Return on account 1121.43%

TradeStation Strategy Performance Report


TradeStation Strategy Performance Report - One Night Stand @SF-Daily (2/4/1976-12/9/2002)

Performance Summary: All Trades

Total Net Profit $83,987.5000 Open position P/L $0.0000
Gross Profit $179,537.5000 Gross Loss ($95,550.0000)

Total # of trades 519 Percent profitable 63.01%
Number winning trades 327 Number losing trades 192

Largest winning trade $3,687.5000 Largest losing trade ($3,037.5000)
Average winning trade $549.0443 Average losing trade ($497.6563)
Ratio avg win/avg loss 1.1033 Avg trade (win & loss) $161.8256

Max consec. Winners 15 Max consec. losers 13
Avg # bars in winners 1 Avg # bars in losers 1

Max intraday drawdown ($7,275.0000)
Profit Factor 1.8790 Max # contracts held 1
Account size required $7,275.0000 Return on account 1154.47%

If (dayofWeek(Date of Tomorrow)=5) and c>average(c,40)
then buy next bar highest(high,4)+1 point stop;

If marketposition=1 then sell next bar market;


If (dayofWeek(Date of Tomorrow)=5) and c<average(c,40)
then sellshort next bar lowest(low,4)-1 point stop;



If marketposition=-1 then buytocover next bar market;

Here's how I remember it: if its friday and thurdays Close is graeter than a 40 day moving average then buy this weeks high on a stop, exit monday at the open. Exact opposite for shorts. don't waste money on joes book.

It's in Joe's latest book which you can buy ( link ) for $7.95 used or $50.00 new.

If it's being given away for free is it possible for someone to post the code for it or the rules ? - I would be most interested to see it - "Do the hard thing" as the turtles say its very true if the trades are easy we can all take em the money is made on the hard trades - to many of which I have consistently miss for that reason ! otherwise could you tell us how where to obtain the system from - many thanks.

One-Night-Stand:

It's Monday:

The O-N-S (system) sold out on the open on both the ECZ (approx. $800 profit) and the BPZ (approx. $300 profit).

This type of trade works about 75% of the time (with approx. $150 profit/contract per trade in my 10 years of actual trading the system after costs), but would be very difficult for most traders to do as a permanent system. And this trade just happened to be a winner.

I do find it interesting that this system which Mr. Krutsinger has been giving away for over a decade works better than most systems which cost thousands (2k to 5k) and deteriorate or fail miserably after months from release.

My point is, the system you trade (or entry signal/exit signal) must have a strong, statistically provable reason why it should work-- for it to continue working. That is why some systems which are based on grain dynamics and only trade grains should work just as well in 50 years as they have for the last 30, ---unless the dynamics of growing grain completely change; which they really haven't in the past 1000 years. But then again, maybe things will change and they will start growing wheat and corn in 20 day seasons. THEN, find a new system for grains.

I believe that systems which are based on the failings of human nature are the most reliable and dynamic systems available. So my vote for the more durable systems now and in the future are volatility-breakout and channel-breakout systems.

This is because they are so hard for the average trader to actually execute these systems over and over and over.... This includes R-Breaker and some systems by Lee Gettess, Bob Buran and many other fine systems revealed in this forum.

That is also why I think the Turtle method will probably always work to a tolerable degree---people have a very hard time consistently trading it. After many losses, people get discouraged, and quit taking trades. And then breakouts start working better than average again.

Leonardo------

One Night Stand--

For a perfect example of the trade in the current EuroFX (dec) and BP (dec), the system went long the BPZ @ 1.5728 and long the ECZ @ 100.22 right after the open this morning on stops.

Now you just exit your longs on Monday's open.

The concept works because people have a strong aversion to staying in currencies over the weekend, and you are getting paid risk premium to hold it over for them.

If you can beat the system somewhat and get in a little earlier you have created additional edge for yourself.

Now you are in with an edge, and (maybe) a decent profit. The system is profitable on its own, but...

if you have reason to hold the positions past Monday morning because of some world development which enhances the trade, you can hold longer and potentially clean up!!!!

That is what speculation is all about---having an edge which you can apply consistently to the markets and reap substantial rewards (occasionally) due to being in when something great happens.

Leonardo-----

I've tested some of his systems, and even traded some of them.

The only one I ever cared for was his One-Night-Stand system. (Maybe I just liked the name)

Not because it was all that profitable..., but because it was so consistent. And you can front-run the system profitably. And change the exit to a more profitable one.

Joe has given it away at more seminars than I'm sure he even remembers. It is a simple breakout system for trading foreign currencies where you get long or short on Friday; hold over the weekend and then get out on the open of Monday.

I wouldn't be surprised if the poster (Anonymous on Wednesday, December 4, 2002 - 12:20 pm) was trading it. The main problem with the system is that at times the foreign currencies are extremely highly correlated and you can lose big (and win big).

But, in my estimation, Joe's systems are just about as good AND as bad as most confirmed systems promoters' systems.

The systems I really trust are those from guys who have been trading for a long while and then finally see something that works consistently and reasonably.

Perverse systems get my notice too. (taking trades because of a rule set that doesn't make you feel good, but has a containable risk, even if large-- like Imaster) Systems which are harder but not impossible to execute are often the very best, because everyone else is looking for something easy to trade.

Some of Joe's systems (and all of mine) fit that category, and I have found them profitable.

Leonardo

Yikes!

Here’s my only experience with honest Joe, early 90’s my 1st try at systems trading, I decided to trade the Swiss franc because the trends looked good, I was all set to trade one of honest Joes systems with a broker of his when honest Joe interjected himself into the process and said I couldn’t trade just the Swiss I had to trade 3 currencies the Swiss, yen, and DM. My account was only $8000, when I said it wasn’t enough to trade all three I could start with one and add others later. “NO! NO!” said honest Joe “that’s not the way to do it, its all three or nothing.” I was a green idiot back then eager to trade, I had no idea one contract would have been over trading my small account let alone 3, but shouldn’t honest Joe have known? Needless to say my account blew up in less than two weeks. I lost $8000 so honest Joe could make $300. Wouldn’t it have been better for Honest Joe to make $300 commission in a couple of months and let my account blow up slowly but fairly? He might have made even more commission had I lasted longer. No, honest Joe can’t wait. He needs his few hundred dollars right away and doesn’t care how many mountains of cash he has to burn to get it. I learned a lesson and Joe earned a life long enemy. See the last episode of the Sopranos Joe? You don’t know how many people hate you, or how close they can be.

I reverse engineered one of his systems as I was evaluating it and although it was decent for a day trading system I wasn't able to get it to perform as well as his. He is a talented system designer with great creativity while fluent in several trading applications. My concern is that he seems to churn out a new system frequently which makes me nervous for various hopefully obvious reasons.

I've talked with people who said he is an upstanding guy but I've heard he charges some 7k for him to set you up with his systems. He does open up the code to his systems.

His systems are terrible silly jokes and his brokerage firm is unscrupulous. Stay away! I regard anything with his name attached to it as total garbage, IMHFO.

"Any guess why JoeKrut hasn't submitted his systems to FT, but chooses to provide his own simluated track-record ?"

That is best to asked to Joe himself. But.....
I met him in the early 90's when he was doing some Public Relations (sales) seminars for TradeStation and I was very unimpressed with his work. Looking at his website IMHO shows that his main focus is optimizing and not "Robusting." I say this as he doesn't use a constant set of markets to show his simulated track record. This is sorta like picking out the best performers and then using the logic of claiming that this is a good system in that market.

As always buyer, beware.

Any guess why JoeKrut hasn't submitted his systems to FT, but chooses to provide his own simluated track-record ?

All I want is to have a reasonable assurance that I'm not looking at the "best optimised params for the month", before I invest the time to further look into any system.

A system creator must "submit" their system to FT before FT will track it. FT doesn't buy systems and track them, nor does it accept third-party donations (a/k/a "piracy") of systems to be tracked.

I would guess that JoeKrut hasn't submitted systems to FT in qute a while. However, there are about four of Joe's early 1990's systems still being tracked, for example "Blue Monday", you could take a look.

Anon,

Not to make FuturesTruth an ultimate authority by which systems are accepted or rejected, but any idea why FT doesn't track JK's systems?

Also, are these systems blackbox or open source ?

I agree that his backtests show PFs of around 2 and low MaxDD, but what about realtime results ? Do you trade Joe's systems yourself and if so, how did they do for you in realtime ?

If you read his book, you'll think that you are in the third grade again. THe most poorly written book with the most absolutely worthless, non-sensical material and systems I've ever seen, in my opinion.

The warnings are here on this list and elsewhere.

If you leave your contact info Dwain will be calling you, but he is a nice guy. They will send out systems to evaluate real time on a trial basis and joe has some of the lowest maxdd's and highest pf's i've seen.

I was looking for system ideas in various places and noticed some references to Joe Krutsinger's systems and visited his site ( http://www.joekrut.com/products.htm ).

His site refers you to another site, of his own again, for (backtested simulated) results. He won't even let you see the marketing (I consider simulated results part of the most basic marketing docs a systems vendor can provide) without giving your full contact details (probably so that the telemarketer can get his turn with you as suggested by someone else below).

Anyway, here's the URL if you want to circumvent the check at the front-door and take a peek at his systems "track records":

http://www.etrackrecords.com/main.html

If you do find the patience, please do share your findings with the forum.

Yeah, but will the CFTC tell you how many systems Joe sells? I mean, the George Angell link informs me that he sold approximately 100 per year, which is pretty good if he kept all the profits, though I suppose he spent alot of it on telemarketers. I wonder how many Aberration systems are sold each year....

If you care to know just how much BS this is, simply call the CFTC for goshsakes. Unreal. It's amazing the bs people will fall for.

That is baloney. They don't fine people because they make more money off the system than the people who trade it. They fine people who say they traded their Grail systems, and made zillions, but in reality haven't traded them and mysteriously have no documentation of trades that they took.
Also Joe maybe an honest guy, I don't know either way. The reality is how many systems do you need to sell when you ask $2500-5000 per system? I was on his email list for awhile and he had a new system about every other week. If he sells 100/yr at the $2500 mark, he is probably doing 10x better than his systems. My 2 cents.

Michael,

You say that "Joe told me that the CFTC had fined people exhorbitantly who traded a system that they also sold if the seller of the system made more money from it than the people he sold it to". I was just wondering how many systems some body like Joe could sell....I mean if he makes a living out of just selling systems he must be selling quite a few of them.

If he is selling that many, how many of them would actually be traded in the markets. Any ideas?

Paul.

Espanol

Thanks for your kindness and contribution to me and this club. I will check Chucks time travel at once...

Golly are you in luck! Not only has Chuck granted your request, he has actually travelled backward in time to do so. It seems he returned to August 17, 1999 to create this thread for your viewing pleasure

http://traderclub.com/discus/messages/18/324.html?MondayDecember2719990649am

and he travelled backwards to Feb 25, 2000 just for you, to create this message area

http://traderclub.com/discus/messages/18/583.html?FridayFebruary920010452pm

It is true that Krutsingers book ¨Trading System Secrets¨ sells for under 20 bucks. But why not buy Schwagers ¨wizards¨ books for 12,80$ each or Tharps ¨trade your way to financial freedom¨ for 23$ instead. I think we all agree upon the fact that these book are not even in the same league.

What I want to say with this is that I am so tired of all these people trying to make easy money from us traders. I know some of Krutsingers work and yes, he knows a lot about trading, a lot more then I will ever know. But why sell books like that? Maybe he isn't even aware of it, maybe he is in the hands of a publisher or something? There is a lot of similar books like that out there though and I want to avoid them... How?

Why not start a thread about good trading books or have a separate site in here for reviews and opinions? Could that be something Chuck?

If Krutsinger's systems are as persistently profitable as his manager then we should consider his contributions. I had the misfortune to give his manager my e-mail since then I have been besieged by e-mail touting his systems. I am sorry I have no respect for this kind of behavior.

If Krutsinger hires ex-telemarketers ? to push his systems then his systems are suspect are they not ?

Joe's been around the block and is an accomplished systems writer. I've met him personally and he's a straight shooter. He's a skilled programmer in EasyLanguage and in Metastock. The systems he sells are considerably better than the ones in his books. The main thing to get from
his books is the process of thinking through system development and finding a system that fits your individual temperament. In my trading, I don't use the systems from his books per se, but I do credit him for helping me become a better systems designer. I have to have respect for anybody who's helped me make money trading. It's probably not fair to expect too much from Trading System Secrets since it sells for under 20 bucks at Amazon.com.

If you have occasion to call Joe Krutsinger on the phone, you'll probably be impressed by his patience and good will. Sure, he's in business and is supposed to be gracious, but he actually does want people to do well.

Some people are critical of the fact that in this stage of his career he makes his living writing systems rather than by trading them. He has made his fair share of trading profits and has walked the walk. His choice, the way he explains it, has mostly to do with intrusive CFTC regulations. If you have followed the recent case of Taucher et al vs. the CFTC, you know that federal regulation in the past several years has been very invasive into the liberties of anyone who publishes systems, runs an advisory service, or sends out a newsletter. Joe told me that the CFTC had fined people exhorbitantly who traded a system that they also sold if the seller of the system made more money from it than the people he sold it to -- that includes getting a fill that's a single tick better than the fill of those who bought the system (something that happens randomly at the exchange). Joe said he wanted to avoid that inflammatory issue altogether. So he made a lifestyle choice. That's his business afterall. He also has a family to provide for and may value security over the excitement of trading in this chapter of his life. Who knows? Anyhow, he has actually made money using his trading methods and he's helped me, so I gotta respect him!

Good Trading,

Michael Stafford
Peerless Investing, LLC

I haven't bought any of his systems but I ordered one of his books called TRADING SYSTEM SECRETS. All I can say it was a very big dissapointment. It is a tiny little book, 80 pages, big text and nothing new in it. I paid around 35 US including shipping to Europe. The worst book I've bought about trading and I've bought/read a few...

If his systems is like his book then you wont be trading for long, trust me...

Anybody have any experiences with Joe Krutsinger or his systems -- good, bad, or ugly?